Trying to stop 'the flip'

This is a great topic. I know it’s an old thread, but maybe it’s good to revive for winter. There are several approaches to addressing a flip. It’s possible to try and “hold” the wedge, but doing so is also a speed killer. Killing speed may not be the end of the world because it’s possible through manipulating impact conditions, delofting the club with solid impact you may see better control and distance. Personally, I think there is a little bit of educating the hands that is required if you are used to flippy impact. But I am a firm believer that the biggest culprit of flipping is bad body movement through the shot. Think about it this way, you can stall the body and drive the arms (holding the wedge in back of right wrist) to the front pocket. However, at any time, if the hands slow down, the forces on the clubhead will outpace the hands which means the club will pass the hands. If that happens before you get hands past the ball, it’s a flip. If your hands drive far enough, you have good impact conditions and the same hand release happens, but when the same action happens after impact, it’s not called a flip, it’s called a release. If the body moves correctly, getting to the front post and turns left, the impact position gets transported to where it’s supposed to be. In other words, your hands don’t have to drive past the ball, if your pivot transports the club bast the ball. You can test this in a mirror. If you stay square facing the ball, you can drive your hands to the front hip, hands in front of club. Looks good. Alternatively, you could lower the hands to your trail hip.leave them there and pivot to front foot…turning your body. In the mirror, as you rotate, you will notice, even though your hands are off your trail hip, when you rotate the body, in the mirror, you will see the lead arm move to the front of your body (because your lead side has moved back and around). Again, you will notice that in the mirror, if you rotate enough the arm appears to be in great impact position. To my way of thinking, there are two ways to arrive at impact without flipping. However, the easiest way to eliminate the flip is to have a correct body pivot that transports the bottom of the swing arc. In snt terms, it’s getting left, tilting, turning, extending…but moving far enough left that the hip goes left and then rotates back and behind…if you can’t transport with the body, then you are relying on muscular thrust which will always be less reliable.

Dan, this may have been covered, but I've struggled with the same thing for years. I think my problem is that I was getting lazy at the ball and not completing my follow through. What I started focusing on is this...just as the left arm goes across you chest on the backswing try hard to ensure your right arm goes across your chest on the follow-thru. This helps me get fully through the shot and as a consequence, most of the time, I've said goodbye to the flip. Good Luck, Dave.

About every guy I see who flips swings from the top down, or the shoulders have "left the barn", the lower body hasn't moved much, thus the hands are too high and too far back in relation to the shoulders and the ball. The only "catch up" move is to slow the hips to make room for the club handle, then a flip of the right hand.

Try a drill that works in reverse, or set up to hit the ball in a pre-set impact position at address, mimic a pro on TV, or pause one of Tom's videos at impact (lead hip ahead of lead shoulder, some backwards tilt, head back, right hand wedge at impact, etc). From that position take the club back and hit the ball...do not move your weight back on the backswing. This is a rotate up 1/2 swing at best due to the position. I bet your right hand will not flip, and I also bet the position will feel very different.

If you really want to end the flips, get the Greg Norman "Secret". It keeps the right hand back. The more you flip, the more you will HATE this training aid, but it works for me and I hit many great shots with the training aid on my right hand. The wrist release will be more like Tom's, or not a roll release so the shot will feel very stable.

@Dan My suggestion, an maybe it was already posted but I didn't read all the comments... and what has work for me.. is think consciously of keeping that Right wrist cupped the way it is on the set up with the shaft lean and not extending it or flipping it... That helps for me.. and when I follow through I stop short.. there is a YouTube video TOM as that shows him holding a alignment stick just below shoulder height on the follow through and having his student extend to that and stopping right there and look at his wrist and hands to make sure that he hasn't flipped and he still has that shaft lean.... I don't have anyone holding the alignment stick but that is what I have been doing with pretty good success.. not perfect or completely fixed but it is way better than what it was

As usual, realised that I probably already know the answer to this. Have gone back to the flipping sections and am now working on not coming over the top and holding onto the cheese wedge. Have been doing 10 left arm only short swings, bowed left wrist after impact and 10 right arm only swings, holding cheese wedge. Club pointing at ground after impact as a checkpoint. Then a few with both hands on club and repeat. The biggest flaw with my left hand only swing is that I tend to start with left hand way past my left thigh, unless I set up with both both hands first in correct position and then take right hand off grip. Onwards and upwards…!

Am also battling flipping. Tom, I'm working on the drills you gave me, more arms etc. Having watched the Andy Plummer YouTube that you recommended, I see that your swing initially got a little too steep when you started working on less of an inside path. This happened to me in a big way yesterday and started coming way over the top.

Admittedly this mega shank only happened once. One of the rare ones that goes straight about a millimetre from the ground!

Should I go back to trying to get my inside out swing back with lean towards target and left shoulder up before I get back to working on the casting? I am determined to get this sorted, but am also aware that it may be a long and frustrating process!

Great advice Tom, I think I've read before about people using athlete's foot spray so will have a look around, thanks!

@Dan - With regard to hitting off mats - which tend to do a great job of masking poor contact - here are a couple of different suggestions that can help you discern between crispy and soggy impact:

1) Get yourself an old hand towel fold it in half. Place it no more than 2 inches behind your ball, thereby requiring you to miss the towel and make ball first contact on your downswing. As you improve, move the towel closer to the ball. The small thickness of a one-half folded towel should not impede your backswing takeaway.

2) Put down a thick chalk line or some inexpensive spray foot powder on the mat about an inch in front of the ball. Try to hit the ball first and then the chalk or powder. The mark on the mat - or lack thereof - will give you instant visual feedback.

I would love to hit off the grass but unfortunately my wife likes our lawn too much... :)

I personally think it’s really important to practice on grass. Mats can be really misleading

Yeah I'm 'working' in quite a confined space so getting a camera set up is tricky but will have a think.

I think I'm definitely going back too far, old habits and all that and then up end getting somewhat stuck, with the only way back ending in an ugly flip and poor contact.

Feels good though with the very little swings (as advised by Tom and others) and straight arms after impact with the ball going straight into the net (most of the time anyway :) )

Many thanks for the advice Gerry, much appreciated.

Doing well with the small swings and getting a bit more confident since yesterday regarding arms straight after impact, trying to keep that wedge.

As soon as I get past that half swing is where the problems start but small steps is what's needed here!

Thanks again!

My logic is that the larger the swing the more chance/time you give yourself to flip during the down swing. Start with smaller swings and work your way up to larger swings. You can get good power with those small swings

My advice is concentrate on ‘arms straight’ Smart ball or TRS or total golf trainer great aids to help with this Video your swing and just keep practicing and practicing and it will eventually click

Welcome to the Forum, Dan. I'm glad to see you here!!

You and I have already had plenty of back-and-forth dialogue on the subject, so instead I will pin your post and thus encourage others in the community to offer their thoughts.

Enjoy the SG Community!!

Tom