Need help fellas, been struggling with a very weak push slice its so bad that I cannot play golf right now. I believe my takeaway is too inside and I’m just pushing it right or getting blocked. Here is where I get messed up. Tom says ”low hands” a lot. I used to suffer from being steep and disconnected. So I really try to keep the top of the backswing lower. It all made sense when I watched the section on wrist angles and wrists breaking. Folding the trail arm when the lead arm goes across the chest combined with tilting, turning, and extending. You should have an ideal backswing. I understand that, it makes plenty of sense, just can’t execute it. For some reason then ball starts right and spins more right (I am right handed). What messes me up is in the videos he says a swing too inside should promote hooks. There are no hooks here all big push fades. I watched the videos on the grid too. It’s very frustrating, I was playing good golf early March when I began the program and then it went away after watching the grid videos. I don’t doubt the system, I know it’s me doing something wrong. So my question is, what causes this push fade?
Thank you all!
Also, the sections I did finish are the golf swing simplified and the shot shaping course with the grid.
@mike9ferrucci - I can only piggyback on @Ronald Burkholder's excellent and thorough reply and offer some supplemental information:
- Charlie Wi provides an excellent model for this swing. Here is my analysis of his swing from the Appendix section of Golf Swing Simplified. There are two separate analyses in that link - face-on and down-the-line. In the DTL view you'll clearly see what Ronald is referring to with regard to the clubface being aligned with the spine and pointing at the ball in the takeaway.
- The Takeaway Section of Fixing Common Swing Problems includes plenty of helpful content. Based on your post I'd suggest going through the first several videos as they address rolling the hands and the club being too low.
- These episodes from the YT channel also may help you with the takeaway & backswing as they speak to Hands In/Club Out and the Concentric Paths of the hands and clubhead throughout the swing (including a rather nifty bird’s eye view). It's crucial to remember that when we talk about taking the hands in, we are not referring to any kind of rolling or snatching motion with the hands.
- Video tells all, and as Ronald suggests you might wish to consider posting your swing videos in the Forum's Video Analysis Room. While I don't personally review these as it conflicts with my V1 service, you may be pleasantly surprised by the knowledge base and helpfulness of this great community!
- Beyond this, you may wish to give some thought to the V1 Swing Video Analysis – an extremely valuable service that I highly recommend to everyone in the school. This enables me to put my eyes on your swing and offer some very specific observations and corrective action plans if applicable. I liken it to bringing your swing into the shop for a tune-up or minor repair. Scheduling one on a quarterly basis for preventive maintenance will do wonders for keeping things humming along nicely, and it's also a great tool for pinpointing and resolving any issues that arise. The process involves downloading the free V1 app and then submitting two videos to me through the app - one down-the-line (captured from your stance line, not the target line) and the other face-on. You'll find more information about the V1 Analysis halfway down this page on the Saguto.Golf site.
Let's get you over this little bump in the road and back to having fun out there!
TS
First, don’t let this worry you. It’s a new swing pattern. Your brain has to figure out the muscle firing sequence before you will get consistent results. I should say consistent good results, since right now your results seem to be a consistent push fade.
Lets review the ball flight laws that result in a push fade. First, the ball starts in the direction the club face is pointed at impact. Second, the ball curves due to a mismatch between the club face direction and the swing path direction at impact. A push fade/slice is caused by the club face being pointed to the right (right handed golfer) of the target line and the swing path bringing the club head from out to in in relation to the club face direction at impact. The more the difference between path and face direction the more curved the ball flight.
So, why is your swing presenting the club face open to the target line while coming from outside to inside?
This is best solved by video analysis. If you post a video of your swing from face on and from down the the target line you will get plenty of help from this forum.
Absent a video I will offer these suggestion. Check your grip. If you have a weak (both hands rotated to the left too much, none or one left hand knuckle showing when you look down at the grip) it can be difficult to square the club face at impact. If your grip looks good ( two to three knuckles visible) you may be rotating your arms clockwise in the backswing. You know this is the case when your club face is not aligned with tilted spine half way back. If you notice the toe is pointed straight up half way back, you rotated the arms. Try to keep the club face pointed toward the ball as you take the club back. I think you may be facilitating the “hands in” backswing by rotating the arms. I think you will find keeping the club face pointed at the ball in the early part of the backswing will stop the forearm rotation and you will find that you must tilt and turn more to get the hands in.
To tackle the club path problem. First, be wary of getting the hands too far in and to low. If this happens, you will most likely come over the top as your arms get stuck and have no other way to get the club head to the ball. The other thing to look at is your construction of the grid. Make sure the hands and club head guides are positioned correctly. Finally, assuming your backswing is on plane make sure you start the downswing with a bump of the left trouser pocket toward the target. This bump clears a path for the hands and arms to approach from inside of the target line and reaching the ball before the club head gets outside the path.
Long answer, sorry. Post a video and we can better zero in on what is causing the push fade.